U.S.-style parking boot comes to Toronto

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gotchya
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U.S.-style parking boot comes to Toronto

Postby gotchya » Tue May 31, 2011 10:29 am

A U.S.-style parking boot - familiar to fans of the show "Parking Wars" - has made its way to Toronto.
Private companies, not the city, are using the devices on allegedly illegally-parked cars.
One man said it amounts to extortion - he was asked to pay $100 on the spot to have the boot removed.
CityNews reporter Francis D'Souza has more in the video below.

http://www.citytv.com/toronto/citynews/news/local/article/133606--u-s-style-parking-boot-comes-to-toronto

Best to watch the video.

Is it legal? Looking at the video it appears their "enforcement officers" might be in contravention of PSIA as they have stipes on their pants which don't appear to be for the purpose of reflecting, and generally the uniforms appear to be similar to those of Toronto Police Parking Enforcement Officers.

The companies website is:
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Re: U.S.-style parking boot comes to Toronto

Postby Paul R » Tue May 31, 2011 12:55 pm

Nothing says professional outfit better than making numbers for your boot with electrical tape. Would be interesting to see what they would do if you towed your car away with one of thier boots on.

Also I see that the wheelnuts are accesable which means you could take your wheel off. Curious to see how the red cable secures to the car.

Looks like a good pinch if they are using that laptop while on a highway as per the cellphone-display screen portion of the HTA. I can't see them being being exempt.

Borderline mischief though. Interefering with your lawful use of your car. Yeah you parked on private property and could be appropriately fined for trespassing but you can't commit a criminal offence to deter a provincial offence. Interesting to see what the crown comes up with.
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Re: U.S.-style parking boot comes to Toronto

Postby gotchya » Tue May 31, 2011 1:08 pm

I was thinking all the above.

And, why aren't they licenced by PISA, their primary mechanism for enforcement is TPA, security's primary legislative tool is TPA. I could see the Ministry getting a little peev'd they aren't licenced.
Last edited by gotchya on Tue May 31, 2011 6:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: U.S.-style parking boot comes to Toronto

Postby GoodWitness » Tue May 31, 2011 3:03 pm

It says in the video that they started earlier this year, were asked by TPS to stop doing it while TPS figured out if it was legal; didn't get a response yet, so they started up again.

Did they buy surplus OPP pants for their guys, or what?

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Re: U.S.-style parking boot comes to Toronto

Postby Madeline236 » Tue May 31, 2011 4:26 pm

I did like the part where the guy says something like "I did see the sign, I did know I could not park here, but I should have been warned!" :ponder

I don't know PISA but uniforms do look a bit to much like they'd confuse people to think they are actual LEOs or municipal parking enforcement.

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Re: U.S.-style parking boot comes to Toronto

Postby Punisher-One » Tue May 31, 2011 5:24 pm

Extortion.

A parking or trespass ticket is a provincial offense that you have the right to defend in a provincial court of law in front of a government appointed official. It does not deny you the use of your own personal property.
This boot is placed on your car by an unregulated private company which now denies you the use of your own personal property. Furthermore you must now pay a private FOR PROFIT unregulated company to remove it and your so called "appeal" is through a private for profit company that has no government authority or oversight whatsoever. They are, in effect, seizing your vehicle without right.

I am not arguing that parking on private property is okay. It is not. I support a provincially mandated (or a private company with provincial oversight ala MLEO-types) organization writing you a provincial ticket which is defensible in a government courtroom.

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Re: U.S.-style parking boot comes to Toronto

Postby Angerman » Tue May 31, 2011 6:15 pm

The only difference I see is in the amount of regulation or oversight, and who collects the revenue.

1) Park on private property in Toronto, get ticketed by an MLEO (city ticket), get towed to an impound and have to pay to get your property back (you can fight the ticket in court later, but you are still just as towed one way or another).
- City gets the revenue from the ticket.
- Tow company gets the revenue from the tow.

2) Park on private property in Toronto, get booted by a private company, pay to get your property back.
- Parking Enforcement company gets the revenue from the booting.

Neither option is really palatable, but throw some checks and balances in there and it amounts to pretty much the same thing, doesn't it? Force them to obtain and maintain MLEO status and adhere to proper signage and fee regulations.

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Re: U.S.-style parking boot comes to Toronto

Postby Homer » Tue May 31, 2011 6:38 pm

I, too like the part about 'the police didn't give a response so we started up again'.

Hmm - I feel like a test. I have a set of old tires that I don't mind destroying if it comes to it, lots of room in the back of the 'Burb for spares (hydraulic jack, air tank & impact wrench too). Who would win in the eyes of the law - the guy removing/damaging someone else's property which was attached to their vehicle or the person immobilizing (seizing without right) the vehicle? If my brand new Pirellis and $1500 rims are damaged, is the company that applied the device liable for damages.

Oh, and yes, I would think that the PSISA does apply to persons whose primary function is to control and enforce access to private property. These guys need to be licensed security guards, get rid of the pant stripes and properly mark their cars as SECURITY.
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Re: U.S.-style parking boot comes to Toronto

Postby Tommy » Tue May 31, 2011 9:49 pm

Homer wrote:Oh, and yes, I would think that the PSISA does apply to persons whose primary function is to control and enforce access to private property. These guys need to be licensed security guards, get rid of the pant stripes and properly mark their cars as SECURITY.



Especially since in the Video he sure looks a lot like a security guard.... Body Armor, Batman belt, etc....

They've got their guys dressing up like serious wanna-be's... I know enough to know theyre nobodies... but the average civiy wouldnt have a clue.... There has to be something out there to prevent em from dressing/acting that way, right?
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Re: U.S.-style parking boot comes to Toronto

Postby Homer » Tue May 31, 2011 10:45 pm

Tommy wrote:
Homer wrote:Oh, and yes, I would think that the PSISA does apply to persons whose primary function is to control and enforce access to private property. These guys need to be licensed security guards, get rid of the pant stripes and properly mark their cars as SECURITY.



Especially since in the Video he sure looks a lot like a security guard.... Body Armor, Batman belt, etc....

They've got their guys dressing up like serious wanna-be's... I know enough to know theyre nobodies... but the average civiy wouldnt have a clue.... There has to be something out there to prevent em from dressing/acting that way, right?

I believe it is the Private Security and Investigative Services Act, 2005:
http://www.mcscs.jus.gov.on.ca/english/ ... _regs.html

Application
2. (1) This Act applies to private investigators within the meaning of subsection (2) and to security guards within the meaning of subsection (4). 2005, c. 34, s. 2 (1).
...
Security guards
(4) A security guard is a person who performs work, for remuneration, that consists primarily of guarding or patrolling for the purpose of protecting persons or property. 2005, c. 34, s. 2 (4).
...
Individual licence
6. No person shall act as a private investigator or a security guard or hold himself or herself out as one unless the person holds the appropriate licence under this Act and,
(a) is employed by a licensed business entity, a registered employer under section 5, or an employer that is not required to be registered; or
(b) is the sole proprietor of a licensed business entity or is a partner in a licensed business entity.


and from ONTARIO REGULATION 362/07 - UNIFORMS

1. A person who is licensed as a security guard and who is required by the Act to wear a uniform when acting as a security guard or holding himself or herself out as one shall wear a uniform that complies with this Regulation when acting as a security guard or holding himself or herself out as one. O. Reg. 362/07, s. 1.
Words and logos, etc.
2. (1) The name, logo or crest of the licensee that employs the security guard must be affixed to the chest of the outermost piece of the uniform. O. Reg. 362/07, s. 2 (1).
(2) The term “SECURITY”, “SÉCURITÉ”, “SECURITY GUARD” or “AGENT DE SÉCURITÉ”, in upper case letters not less than 1.5 centimetres high and in a colour that contrasts with the dominant colour of the uniform ...

Trouser stripes
6. The trousers must not have stripes, other than reflective safety stripes, down the side.


QED.
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Re: U.S.-style parking boot comes to Toronto

Postby Tommy » Tue May 31, 2011 11:14 pm

Sounds to me like it's only a matter of time before the hammer falls on them then....


God I am so glad I got out of private security years ago....
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Re: U.S.-style parking boot comes to Toronto

Postby TwE@k » Wed Jun 01, 2011 8:37 pm

I would have to say this is very much Extortion. The fact has been brought up.....there is no court process to make an appeal, it is through the very same company that booted you in the first place. As far as the PISGA stuff I don't think they are "Security guards" in the traditional sense. I think they are only out to writer tickets and boot thus they are not providing a Security service. There are a few companies out there that do this sort of thing (sans boot though). I feel like this is going to go poorly for the company and is going to go sideways on the guys/gals doing the booting in a hurry.


Either way it is a GIANT load of BS :cuss:
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Re: U.S.-style parking boot comes to Toronto

Postby RemingtonSteel » Wed Jun 01, 2011 8:50 pm

For those interested, here is a full video of people being booted and the officers doing it:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f_Np7h06 ... g&index=12

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Re: U.S.-style parking boot comes to Toronto

Postby Tommy » Wed Jun 01, 2011 9:00 pm

I like how at 3:39 in the video "Wanna-Be" threatens to "Charge" them with "Criminal Mischief" if they attempt to take the boot off......

Wow..... This is gonna go so sideways so fast for these guys as soon as they boot the wrong person....

After watching that video it looks to me like they are trying really really hard to look just like TPS Parking enforcement... If they are not Security, how do you ding them for acting the way they are by essentially playing Dress-up?
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Re: U.S.-style parking boot comes to Toronto

Postby RemingtonSteel » Wed Jun 01, 2011 9:42 pm

Tommy wrote:I like how at 3:39 in the video "Wanna-Be" threatens to "Charge" them with "Criminal Mischief" if they attempt to take the boot off......

Wow..... This is gonna go so sideways so fast for these guys as soon as they boot the wrong person....


Listen really closely, the guy says "Screw it, you can keep the tire, I'm just going to take it off", then the guy threatens to charge him with criminal mischief..... not only would the charge be incorrect, I'd argue that it'd be an unlawful arrest. Mischief would be if he damages or renders the boot inoperable, just taking the tire off and putting on a new one hasn't damaged the boot.

I kinda feel bad for the guys on the front line here, I know they are just doing their jobs the way they were trained.... unfortunately I would argue that what they have been told and trained to do is quite wrong and they might be the unfortunate ones to get bit in the ass over it all.
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