BC Sherrif's, cheap Highway cops?

General Law Enforcement discussion which does not fit into other channels. Post your thoughts and feelings about anything you want (LE related), or just vent those fumes about whatever is on your chest.
User avatar
BROVO26
Regular Member
Posts: 95
Joined: Mon Jan 26, 2009 4:57 pm
Location: Home sweet home
Contact:

BC Sherrif's, cheap Highway cops?

Postby BROVO26 » Tue Sep 07, 2010 10:56 pm

KAMLOOPS (NEWS1130) - Sheriffs in B.C. will soon be doing traffic enforcement and nabbing speeders in our province. About a dozen sheriffs in Kamloops will be pulled away from their regular duties as part of the pilot program.

No word yet on when the project will start, and details are still being ironed out on how much authority the sheriffs will be given if they pull over a car with drugs or weapons inside.

Dean Purdy, with the union that represents the sheriffs in B.C., says sheriffs have been doing traffic duty in Alberta since 2006 and it's worked well there. "It's made an immediate impact by reducing the number of speeding violations, deaths and the reduction of outstanding warrants. Not to mention, it's allowed the police to concentrate on investigating serious crimes like shootings and gang violence."

He says sheriffs are well trained to handle the added responsibility. "B.C. Sheriffs have received the same training that police officers get at the police academy, specific to those duties that they would be expected to perform like traffic duties."

If the program is successful in Kamloops it may go province-wide.



So now BC is getting court officers to do Police work, at a lesser price? :ponder:
It's not if you win or lose, but how you place the blame.

Whistler
Veteran Member
Posts: 226
Joined: Sat Dec 16, 2006 3:13 pm
Contact:

Re: BC Sherrif's, cheap Highway cops?

Postby Whistler » Tue Sep 07, 2010 11:10 pm

Honestly when I see Alberta and BC doing this it makes me think they are dipping their feet in the pool and testing out the idea of going back to provincial police vs the RCMP.

ASGPS Sheriff
Rookie Member
Posts: 39
Joined: Mon Oct 13, 2008 12:26 am
Contact:

Re: BC Sherrif's, cheap Highway cops?

Postby ASGPS Sheriff » Tue Sep 07, 2010 11:10 pm

It called tiered policing and it is on its way in, they will most likely receive the core requirement that Police do at the JIBC for anything that they may encounter at traffic stops.

User avatar
BROVO26
Regular Member
Posts: 95
Joined: Mon Jan 26, 2009 4:57 pm
Location: Home sweet home
Contact:

Re: BC Sherrif's, cheap Highway cops?

Postby BROVO26 » Tue Sep 07, 2010 11:23 pm

I think Police officers should be doing police work, not court officers. How many layers of enforcement does BC need? Muni-cops,RCMP,Transit Police and now Sherrifs? All RCMP, okay,a new Provincial Police, fine,but make up your mind.Who is going to pay for this system? Yup, the taxpayer. :crazy:
It's not if you win or lose, but how you place the blame.

User avatar
Dave Jenkins
Grand Poobah
Posts: 961
Joined: Sun Oct 12, 2003 11:56 pm
Contact:

Re: BC Sherrif's, cheap Highway cops?

Postby Dave Jenkins » Tue Sep 07, 2010 11:37 pm

I find it of interest that Alberta and BC are doing this. Both have had a fair amount of debate on the subject of RCMP contracting within their respective provinces. It seems a logical assumption that a base is being constructed upon which to building or rebuilding provincial police forces. These sheriff services are armed agencies that, with additional training, could conceivably be transformed into provincial police agencies. To me the "cheap highway cop" angle is something that will likely be short lived as I doubt that is the long term vision for these entities.

Ontario and Quebec kept their provincial police forces and as can be seen there is no sheriffs out paroling their highways. In Ontario police service special constables have been kept on a short leash as far as what they are used for and enforcement is not part of their mandates. Non police service special constable in Ontario do enforcement but do so in relation to very specific property/transit systems and not the public highways and byways so to speak. All provinces have an ability to appoint special constables for a variety of duties and this would have been the easiest way to go about creating "cheap highway cops".

Time will tell and for once and in a somewhat bizarre twist Ontario will become the model. What I mean by this is that Ontario is in the process of uploading court security and offender transport costs off the backs of the municipal police services. It is still a work in progress but frankly I think that as this progresses the Ontario Provincial Police will take over the courts and offender transport rather than the province paying the municipal forces to provide the service. The OPP have and will continue to have domain over the highways. They can and have been contracted to replace municipal police services. They police remote areas that can not sustain a municipal police structure. All will be under the one umbrella of a provincial police service. This is what I see for BC and Alberta. A nice neat package (one agency).
An error does not become truth by reason of multiplied propagation, nor does truth become error because nobody sees it.
-Mahatma Gandhi

User avatar
Dave Jenkins
Grand Poobah
Posts: 961
Joined: Sun Oct 12, 2003 11:56 pm
Contact:

Re: BC Sherrif's, cheap Highway cops?

Postby Dave Jenkins » Tue Sep 07, 2010 11:45 pm

BROVO26 wrote:I think Police officers should be doing police work, not court officers. How many layers of enforcement does BC need? Muni-cops,RCMP,Transit Police and now Sherrifs? All RCMP, okay,a new Provincial Police, fine,but make up your mind.Who is going to pay for this system? Yup, the taxpayer. :crazy:


Political wheels turn slowly. You are not going to create a provincial police service over night. The respective sheriff services can quite conceivably be forged into the platform on which to build (resurrect) provincial police services. Oddly enough policing is the domain of the individual province and removing RCMP as contracted municipal police and building self directed provincial police services puts the provinces directly back in the driver's seat of control over policing in their province.
An error does not become truth by reason of multiplied propagation, nor does truth become error because nobody sees it.
-Mahatma Gandhi

Dudley DoRight
Lord of the Poobahs
Posts: 1008
Joined: Wed Dec 14, 2005 3:02 pm
Contact:

Re: BC Sherrif's, cheap Highway cops?

Postby Dudley DoRight » Wed Sep 08, 2010 12:11 am

4 words...New brunswick Highway Patrol. The political mess only lasted a few years when the force finally folded in disgrace with one of their members murdered on the US border. What happens when a traffic stop runs into gangbangers/bikers/weapons/drugs...you know, all those things Piperline talks about. How about stolen property, prohib drivers, warrants, impaired by drug or alcohol, guns, defective vehicles.....all the stuff you find attached to a speeding ticket. No training...no charges and a dangerous situation for an untrained Sheriff.

User avatar
Dave Jenkins
Grand Poobah
Posts: 961
Joined: Sun Oct 12, 2003 11:56 pm
Contact:

Re: BC Sherrif's, cheap Highway cops?

Postby Dave Jenkins » Wed Sep 08, 2010 12:19 am

Dudley DoRight wrote:4 words...New brunswick Highway Patrol. The political mess only lasted a few years when the force finally folded in disgrace with one of their members murdered on the US border. What happens when a traffic stop runs into gangbangers/bikers/weapons/drugs...you know, all those things Piperline talks about. How about stolen property, prohib drivers, warrants, impaired by drug or alcohol, guns, defective vehicles.....all the stuff you find attached to a speeding ticket. No training...no charges and a dangerous situation for an untrained Sheriff.


Not that I disagree with what you have said I truly think that what we are seeing it the birth/rebirth of provincial police in BC and Alberta. There must be a platform upon which to build such a force and a sheriff's service is a convenient way in which to achieve this. When BC's provincial police were dissolved in 1950 many of its members were taken on by the RCMP which (obviously) already existed. I think what were are seeing is a reverse engineering of a sort.
An error does not become truth by reason of multiplied propagation, nor does truth become error because nobody sees it.
-Mahatma Gandhi

User avatar
Dave Jenkins
Grand Poobah
Posts: 961
Joined: Sun Oct 12, 2003 11:56 pm
Contact:

Re: BC Sherrif's, cheap Highway cops?

Postby Dave Jenkins » Wed Sep 08, 2010 12:22 am

Further to my spiel on creating provincial police forces I think this an interesting view from back in 2001. It is not all about policing. In fact in actuality that subject is only a small fraction of the letter. But please note the signators of the “open” letter. Somewhat amusing I think.


http://www.cbc.ca/canadavotes2004/leade ... rewall.pdf

As published in the National Post on Jan. 24, 2001, headlined “An open letter to Ralph Klein

…….”Start preparing now to let the contract with the RCMP run out in 2012 and create an Alberta Provincial Police Force. Alberta is a major province. Like the other major provinces of Ontario and Quebec, we should have our own provincial police force. We have no doubt that Alberta can run a more efficient and effective police force than Ottawa can – one that will not be misused as a laboratory for experiments in social engineering.”…….

Sincerely yours,
Stephen HARPER, President, National Citizens’ Coalition;
Tom FLANAGAN, professor of political science and former Director of Research, Reform
Party of Canada;
Ted MORTON, professor of political science and Alberta Senator-elect;
Rainer KNOPFF, professor of political science;
Andrew CROOKS, chairman, Canadian Taxpayers Federation;
Ken BOESSENKOOL, former policy adviser to Stockwell Day, Treasurer of Alberta.
An error does not become truth by reason of multiplied propagation, nor does truth become error because nobody sees it.
-Mahatma Gandhi

User avatar
Transitpopo
Regular Member
Posts: 93
Joined: Sun Jul 08, 2007 4:47 am
Location: Wild Rose Country
Contact:

Re: BC Sherrif's, cheap Highway cops?

Postby Transitpopo » Wed Sep 08, 2010 12:33 am

Dudley DoRight wrote:4 words...New brunswick Highway Patrol. The political mess only lasted a few years when the force finally folded in disgrace with one of their members murdered on the US border. What happens when a traffic stop runs into gangbangers/bikers/weapons/drugs...you know, all those things Piperline talks about. How about stolen property, prohib drivers, warrants, impaired by drug or alcohol, guns, defective vehicles.....all the stuff you find attached to a speeding ticket. No training...no charges and a dangerous situation for an untrained Sheriff.



Well that's easy, train them. Then they won't be untrained.

User avatar
No 20 Year Medal
King Poobah
Posts: 1725
Joined: Sun Feb 04, 2007 5:10 pm
Location: Collecting shoulder flashes in the CFL Club
Contact:

Re: BC Sherrif's, cheap Highway cops?

Postby No 20 Year Medal » Wed Sep 08, 2010 4:41 am

Dudley DoRight wrote:4 words...New Brunswick Highway Patrol.
Image Image
POLICE CONSTABLE

My patch traders page: http://public.fotki.com/No20YearMedal/

User avatar
Alberta Blue
Sage Member
Posts: 487
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2007 9:22 pm
Contact:

Re: BC Sherrif's, cheap Highway cops?

Postby Alberta Blue » Wed Sep 08, 2010 7:18 am

Dudley DoRight wrote:4 words...New brunswick Highway Patrol. The political mess only lasted a few years when the force finally folded in disgrace with one of their members murdered on the US border. What happens when a traffic stop runs into gangbangers/bikers/weapons/drugs...you know, all those things Piperline talks about. How about stolen property, prohib drivers, warrants, impaired by drug or alcohol, guns, defective vehicles.....all the stuff you find attached to a speeding ticket. No training...no charges and a dangerous situation for an untrained Sheriff.


You are perpetuating a myth here. The "untrained" Sheriffs in Alberta receive the same training (or in some cases more advanced training) in traffic enforcement as any municipal or RCMP traffic member in Alberta.

We run into "gangbangers/bikers/weapons/drugs...you know, all those things Piperline talks about. How about stolen property, prohib drivers, warrants, impaired by drug or alcohol, guns, defective vehicles" all the time, and are quite prepared to deal with them.

User avatar
To a T
Grand Poobah
Posts: 739
Joined: Sun Feb 07, 2010 11:19 am

Re: BC Sherrif's, cheap Highway cops?

Postby To a T » Wed Sep 08, 2010 10:54 am

:roll:
Last edited by To a T on Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Dave Jenkins
Grand Poobah
Posts: 961
Joined: Sun Oct 12, 2003 11:56 pm
Contact:

Re: BC Sherrif's, cheap Highway cops?

Postby Dave Jenkins » Wed Sep 08, 2010 12:06 pm

We here in Ontario must remember that the likes of our special constables and their "peace officer" authority as laid out in their appointments is somewhat unique when compared to other non police agencies in other provinces. Like men, not all peace officers are created equally. Just because they carry the appointment of "peace officer" does not mean they can enforce the Criminal Code like Ontario specials have the pleasure of doing.

Peace officers in some agencies in other provinces in some cases have limited criminal code authority. It all boils down to their appointment and what is conferred through it. If their appointment does not confer authority X then they do not have that authority and are thus not peace officers in that circumstance. It is like Ontario where the majority of specials have "police authority" restricted to specified provincial acts rather than all. Be wary of terminology.
An error does not become truth by reason of multiplied propagation, nor does truth become error because nobody sees it.
-Mahatma Gandhi

OCCOP
Veteran Member
Posts: 219
Joined: Sat Mar 10, 2007 9:59 pm
Contact:

Re: BC Sherrif's, cheap Highway cops?

Postby OCCOP » Wed Sep 08, 2010 12:22 pm

Let me get this straight, they get the same training and work for the Provincial Government, they carry a firearm and will now do "police" work...Why call them Sheriffs? :ponder:

Just give them the same authority and call them them some sort of Police. (BC Highway Police, BC Transportation Police, British Columbia Provincial Police etc.)

Sounds logical to me...the only thing that would be illogical is the need to call in another police service to help.
Why, if they could do it all themselves? It is just to justify the RCMP or whoever is supporting them?

They may not yet be ready to take over the province but taking what they can and scaling back on their reliance on the RCMP makes sense to me (considering they're already making this sort of move).

But its politics...and that is rarely logical.
"He who loses control loses!"


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: AhrefsBot and 1 guest